if u dont like warwick then go live somewhere else all u people do is moan about something
warwick mop
if u dont like warwick then go live somewhere else all u people do is moan about something
I love Warwick! (If you think I am one of 'u people')
It's the chaos the Mop causes I can't stand! Why not have the Mop in St.nicks park? The tradition of the mp is preserved, and the shop keeps have nothing to grumble about, wouldn't that be lovely??
Has it been and gone? I wanted to go this year and look around the shops. My bro does every year. It's not the business you do or don't do on the night it's the follow on business you get throughout the year from people that wouldn't normally come to the town but have and notice you're shop. They may not even enter but they think ooow look there's a a nice shop, when we come back to do some shopping.... or even may make a special trip if its a furniture shop or antique shop.
Madhatter
Madhatter, it's back again this weekend for the runaway fair. Friday and Saturday night. Have fun!
Ready for this?
I have to say... It was better this year, as far as I'm concerned anyway!
Generators were mostly tucked away in the car park, so much less fumes and din, and there seems to be a change in the ~DJ ~ as instead of 10 or 15 second bursts of a handful of tunes repeating, they were playing whole songs. Much better!
I still can't see why it couldn't be held off the road, as it were, but it was tolerable this year ( for the first time, from my point of view) so well done to the organisers.
I am a great believer in speaking up if something isn't right or is an issue, but equally I believe in giving credit when it is due. In this case it is good to see what seems to be an effort made to make the whole business of mopping easier on the business community and I see chillitt is of like mind.
Cool
I believe we should all speak up about issues that bother us.
That's the most democratic way of getting things sorted, and also most civil.
If we are not heard -then we must speak a bit louder-and then maybe louder still' until 'they' listen..
What riles me is when someone says-if you don't like it -then move house---go away ---switch off! The issues are still there and don't get solved that way.
So -Timbo 1911--that was not very polite, was it now ?
However I talk too much ,so I d like to say welcome to you as a new member.
Last edited by cathidaw; 26-10-2008 at 10:56 PM.
Here we go again. Let's get a few things straight.
FACT - The Charter says that the local council can, if they wish, hold a mop. If they decide to hold a mop they are required by law to tender for the provider of the mop (best value for the ratepayers etc.), but of course they don't! The Showmans guild have no more right to mount the mop than anyone else.
FACT - The local businesses would love to have the mop as it was and in the traditional way that involved the whole town. If the mop must consist of a funfair completely unrelated to its traditions then move it somewhere more suitable.
FACT - The town businesses lose in excess of 1 million pounds over the two weeks.
FACT - The local council (ie ratepayers) is compensated by charging the funfair.
FACT - The local council do not compensate the local businesses.
FACT - Almost without exception, residents who like the mop do not live or work in the town. During the last review of the mop almost all the residents and businesses wanted it moved (if you don't believe me contact WDC and obtain the evidence from the review)
FACT - We, the taxpayers, pay for all the extra policing.
FACT - The Warwick Town Centre Manager is paid to promote the economic prosperity of the town. But part of his job spec is to manage the mop, which does anything but.
So, love it or loathe it, please get your facts straight before you lay in to Chillitt and others who are trying to make a living and to residents who have their lives turned upside down by fumes, noise and violence.
Ok then,
point taken,
FACT - the showmans guild is a representative body for owners of their own stalls, sounds pretty much like a chamber of trade to me.
FACT - there is no increased cost in policing a budget is set at the start of the year and it comes from that including the policicng of the much loved 'victorian evening' and other events run by the town and the chamber of trade, who have to pay the rides to attend.
FACT - the mop is a family event again this years proves that.
Myth - I love the mop
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Beer in one hand - Kebab in the other body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming : Woo Hoo, what a ride
This does make an interesting read! Spread over so many pages, I think I'm noticing a trend. Perhaps Toad and Chillitt don't like the Mop?
So let me throw a few real FACTS into the mix for anyone wishing to hear the other side of this debate.
FACT - Warwick Mop has happened for centuries, and yes the fun fair came along later (around the time of the industrial revolution), with its bright lights, steam engines and wait for it thrill rides! Now I know the thrills of Victorian times were a little different from today, but lets face it the shop keepers would have lived in Warwick and been cycling to work rather than complaining about parking. (Oh sorry, separate thread where Toad and Chillitt are maoning!)
FACT - Each shopkeeper opened their shop knowing the Mop takes place, instead of choosing Leamington, Kenilworth, Nuneaton, Bedworth...the list goes on, of towns who do not have Mop Fairs! Upon opening their shop a couple realised they would be disrupted a bit four days a year...thats right the Mop isn't in town the other 361! So this couple of shopkeepers set about a campaign to move it by whatever means they see fit, and let's be honest there have been some creative ones over the years!
FACT - Every year so called figures are put about by one individual who seems to have a greater grudge than others. He and a number of friends randomly spout figures like 'millions lost' etc. If Warwick shopkeepers make a million pounds in four days I'd suggest they are rich enough from their takings the rest of the year to let others enjoy themselves for those four days.
FACT - The Mop has hundreds of supporters, it wouldn't happen if thousands of Warwick residents and visitors from further afield didn't come to the town. Online surveys have been carried out by the local press and without fail each time the Mop comes up trumps, this FACT can be viewed at the papers own website.
I could go on and on, but will no doubt soon be recieving a bunch of new Mop Myths in response to this information so perhaps we shall leave it here for now. I would of course be more than happy to address the points raised on here, if other forum members would like to know.
In future I shall keep an eye on this forum, it may be interesting to see what is added.
Showman, I have just had a look for the poll in the local paper and cannot find anything except reports of the arrests at last years mop and interview with mop organisers telling us how lucky we are to have it here, care to post a link?
Oh and the 4 days of disruption doesn't seem to include the set up days, this year people were being told not to use the roadside parking from midday on the Thursday, So thats 6 days of disruption (I'm not counting Sundays as few shops are open then- only seems fair.)
Are you saying only people who cycle to work are allowed an opinion on the town centre? really? As I have said before we do need someway to get our stock a,into our shops, and b, out and delivered to our customers.
Oh, yes, Still waiting to see a copy of this charter... no rush..
If you so desperately want to see the charter, as I'm guessing you didnt come on the first Saturday to hear it being read, I suggest writing to the Warwick Town Council under FOI and requesting a copy that is where it is stored.
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Beer in one hand - Kebab in the other body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming : Woo Hoo, what a ride
OK so it's not in the Lord Privy Seals office where all the other Royal Charters are then?Originally Posted by f'north
May I take issue with a couple of your points?
I have never (and nor has anyone else I know) said I don't like the Mop or that I want it stopped. What I have said (along with many others) is that it has outgrown the town setting and should be moved to a more suitable venue (Nottingham did this several years ago and now have the very successful Goose Fair.)
I have never complained about parking - since pay and display it has been much better.
Actually, when we opened our shop it coincided exactly with the mop and no, we had not been warned! We delayed the opening and went to the pub!
It does cost a million pounds in lost turnover (not profit - there is a big difference!) because it isn't just the 6 days that the mop is in town it is the 3 weeks around the mop that is affected. All our regular customers avoid the town from the first to the last week in October because (like Easter) no one knows when it's coming - so they stay away just in case. So the million pounds is actually spread out over about 18 days; which is where the figure comes from - it's well researched with figures from those that are affected.
As to the mops success? It's strange that so many moppers tell me that their takings are awful and they only attend because they are told to. Most that I speak to wish it was at a more suitable venue.
During the revue the Chamber of Trade (representing the businesses) and many local representatives and residents said that they supported the mop but wanted it to move so that it could expand and become successful. It was the stupidity and short-sightedness of the Showmans Guild and the local council (who, illegally, refuse to put the event out to tender) that forced it to remain in the town. So it's a no win situation all round.
Toad, that was probably the most balanced reply to any thing I have seen raised on this thread, and I am for once in agreement with everything in it.
Chillit.... follow this link to the first official recording about Warwicks Charter fair I have been able to find Gazetteer of Markets and Fairs in England and Wales to 1516
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Beer in one hand - Kebab in the other body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming : Woo Hoo, what a ride
Thanks for that. As far as I can see that say the fair has to be in the borough, not actually in the Market place, the Only place specifically mentioned is the Manor.. It seems to me to say it should be in August, 24th is St. Batholomews day so clearly there is some room for negotiation...
...Unless it's the feast of Simon and Jude on 28th October, which started almost 400 years after the Market charter was granted, making the market one of the oldest traditions in Warwick, by a long way so why should that have to make way for the Mop?
Last edited by chillitt; 17-11-2008 at 12:01 AM.
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